This piece is part of the weekly series “Growing Forward: Insights for Building Better Food and Agriculture Systems,” presented by the Global Food Institute at the George Washington University and the nonprofit organization Food Tank. Each installment highlights forward-thinking strategies to address today’s food and agriculture related challenges with innovative solutions. To view more pieces in the series, click here.
Jonathan Kung is a chef, cookbook author, and influential content creator known for his vibrant “third culture” cooking—blending cultural traditions, flavors, and ingredients that hold personal meaning. After working in some of Detroit’s top kitchens, he launched the successful pop-up Kung Food Market Studio. When the COVID-19 pandemic forced its closure, Kung pivoted to social media. Since then, he has amassed a following of more than 2 million. Through short-form videos, he not only shares inventive recipes but also delivers accessible, reliable messaging on food, nutrition, and climate.
Food Tank President Danielle Nierenberg spoke with Kung about what it means to be a third culture cook, how to combat misinformation around nutrition and health, and the local, grassroots communities that he hopes to see more young people plug into to drive change.
You identify as a third culture cook. Can you explain what that means to you?
Being a person of third culture is a specific lived experience. It’s where you grew up on the precipice of two very distinct cultures: the one that inhabited the home where you lived, and a completely separate one that operates directly outside of that home. In my case, I grew up in a very Chinese household and that household was in North America.
From my early childhood through to adulthood, I have crossed a cultural threshold and had to dance, communicate, laugh, eat, and drink the differences between the two on a daily basis. It’s not a good or a bad thing. I was able to use it as a creative outlet, and I express that through my food. We have some wonderful nuances and the ability to combine our experiences in both worlds into something completely distinct.
And it’s not unique to my Chinese experience. In the United States, there are third culture Mexicans, third culture Nigerians, third culture French. And though the cultures we came from are completely different, a lot of us have found that we have things in common including how we see the world, how we understand humor, how we communicate, and how we have an increased level of empathy.
Crossing a cultural threshold every day can be traumatizing for some people, right?
It is difficult. But I’ve always found that few things that are worth it are ever easy. Yes, growing up is hard, and growing up in this way can be isolating. Eventually you realize there is a whole world of people out there. And as you grow up, you will find these people like I did. I found these people through TikTok. And as your world gets bigger, you will meet other people who are like you, and you will bounce ideas off each other, and hopefully you will create some delicious and beautiful things as a result.
You’ve been able to use your life experiences to raise awareness around the epidemic of loneliness in this country and the need for more empathy. How do you look at these two ideas right now?
Loneliness seems to be inflicted on us through so many different sources.
I think a lot of it has to do with this younger generation growing up isolated through COVID. That’s what they knew. We communicate with each other through screens now more than we do in person, unless we have to go to work. And there’s nowhere for us to hang out anymore. The third places are gone.
Loneliness can also come from an inability to be uncomfortable around people who don’t think exactly in the way you do. That includes people who are morally opposed to you. But it also includes people within our own political or moral camps. We’re not as used to being as uncomfortable as we once were. That makes us a lot less tolerant. One person can say the wrong thing or not know the right thing at the right time, and that’s so easily used as the cause for that person to get shunned. And it’s not even about intent; it just happens in the moment because of what they did or didn’t know at the time. I think in that way, a lot of that loneliness can be self-inflicted.
You care deeply about the world of sustainability in our food and agriculture systems. What are you seeing and hearing about the way that others are thinking about this?
Up until this current administration, there seemed to be a positive trend towards a desire to live sustainably. Now a lot of people are just trying to survive. You can’t blame anyone for that, but climate change is still very real. It’s a train we cannot stop. We had the luxury of worrying about that. A lot of us still do, but not enough of us.
I can still try to lead by example in my content. One thing I love to do is hide sustainable practices under the veil of economic responsibility. Saving money by reusing things as much as possible is something that I learned working in restaurants, just trying to turn a profit. All of these things are in step with each other and are very easily passed through videos as little tidbits of knowledge.
This is a generation that seems less focused on consumerism. At the same time, young folks lack representation when it comes to decision-making or policy-making. I wonder how that is shaping what we’re seeing around food and agriculture decision-making?
I think young people, in general, do care about policy, especially from the basis of health and wellbeing. Where our food comes from, what is used on our food–that’s more likely to incite willingness to vote and shape policymaking. Unfortunately, especially in the short form media space, there is so much information that drives passion. It can get them engaged, but a lot of their actions are not informed by science.
With climate, it seems like we are very well educated. We know what is good and bad for the planet. But when it comes to our own health and wellness, a lot of people are willing to believe anything. And we can see it’s not only young people who believe these things. It’s people in positions of power too. And it does inform their desire to take action but unfortunately, the messaging isn’t always accurate.
Is there a particular strategy you have found useful in getting that messaging across?
In short form media, people have realized that retention of attention is much more successful when you are bringing rage as opposed to joy. I don’t like to get people angry in my content too much. I like to exude as much peace as much as I can in my videos.
But there are still things that are worth getting angry over. And when it comes to climate, when it comes to misinformation, I’m very passionate about these topics. I can get pretty heated up. My passion shows through, and I think people respond to that.
The misinformation that’s coming from many political leaders about food and health can be misleading, and a lot of people believe it. How do we counteract that?
I haven’t yet figured out whether people believe him because they actually believe him, or whether they believe him because he is on their side politically.
People act against their own interests all the time and people tend to see politics almost like a sports team. No matter what, no matter what they do to us, no matter how much they disappoint us, we will always vote this way. I wonder what would happen if someone like Robert F. Kennedy, Jr., the Secretary of Health and Human Services, were spewing these messages from the other side of the aisle, would they still think the same things? Would they still so readily believe him? I haven’t figured that out.
I can debunk and re-share videos from other scientists, other actual doctors and researchers in the field of vaccine studies. But I don’t know where that disbelief in vaccines is coming from or where the seed was planted that eventually grew into this fanatical belief.
There are a lot of people I love and admire in the food, nutrition, health, and agriculture space who are excited about the Make America Healthy Again movement. Are you seeing the same thing happening?
RFK starts off with quite mild things that are relatable, understandable, and generally accepted. There is this idea people believe that the food we consume, by and large, is unhealthy and that pesticides are not food for us. This seems to be where things begin and then it spirals out of control from there.
And it isn’t to say we have a perfect food system. We have a very consumer-driven, pleasure-driven diet, because we are a country of plenty. We have a lot of hedonistic snacks that are very easy and very cheap. Then we also have a lot of processed foods, which also is a word that people are terrified by, but really has no actual meaning in these conversations. Everybody thinks ultra-processed only means potato chips and french fries. But that also means your protein powders and your vitamins.
When people focus on these buzzwords, which they often do, and then correlate those buzzwords with things that they know are not good for them, they completely ignore the fact that we know what to do. We know we’re supposed to eat more fruits and vegetables and more whole foods. The right thing to do is often in front of us, but is so easily overshadowed by what is fun and easy.
And we need to take issues of access into account, because not everyone has access to fresh fruit, vegetables, and nutritious meals. That’s another issue because those folks often don’t have the same choices available.
I’m pretty no-nonsense in the advice that I give. I don’t really know enough to be complicated. I pay attention to tracking macronutrients, vitamins, and making sure that I get everything that I need. And I always make sure that I have the okay from the doctors and nutritionists that I follow.
What advice do you have for young people who want to get involved but don’t always understand the connections between food, nutrition and climate?
The best thing that you can do is look for a physical community in your area. Farmers markets are still a good spot. Not only do you have the opportunity to get politically involved, but you can meet your farmers and do community supported agriculture, see what they’re doing, find out the message boards that they’re a part of. Those grassroots communities are still very active and very passionate, and it is very easy to fall into them. Now, you may have to live in a city to do that, but they are out there.
For people in smaller communities, the internet is still a very good resource. There are a lot of content creators who are farmers, and they’re spread all over. Farmer Nick is one example. And Alexis Nikole, the Black Forager, is another very good person. There are many people who are entertaining to watch and extremely educational and will happily hand out resources.
Do you have a call to action?
Get involved. Please, please don’t lose hope. Let’s not fall into a pit of nihilism with everything that’s happening. Stay active. Stay positive.
Photo courtesy of Meagan Stone, Unsplash
